Zach Barocas of Jawbox gets personal on The Trap Set podcast
“I was a [ highschooL ] junior twice and a senior twice, but I think that’s because I didn’t know what else to do”
The influential drummer of Jawbox, The Up On In and Bells≥ talks about his childhood, career and struggles with addiction.
Zach Barocas is one of the all-time great rock drummers. Like 2 of my other favorite drummers—Sara Lund of Unwound and Battles’ John Stanier his drumming is rarely about providing a rhythm (or at least, solely about that) and instead acts as another riff or melodic element.
This 2016 interview with the drummer-focused podcast The Trap Set doesn’t really get into drums but what it does get into is extremely compelling. It might be subtle I think a lot of creative people will be able to relate to Barocas’ life experiences—struggling to get through high school for really no reason at all, the amorphous rage that attracts us to punk and hardcore, and the dark fact that what attracts us to creative activities is why so many of us end up addicts.
This exchange about whether he and his brother, a biomedical engineer, are opposites is insightful in regards to addiction*:
“He and I are pretty sure we’re very much alike...
We [people] pick up on ways, we intuitively and instinctively have ways, and we’re wired in ways that lead us to certain sets of behaviours. Every alchoholic I know is basically the same, in terms of the alchoholism. Most of us drank too much and ruined everything or came very close, and hurt a lot of people and lost a lot of money and went to court. And then either stopped drinking or did it all again. And that doesn’t change much. I think in my brother’s case he found a lot of the same kinds of comfort—that I might have found in drugs or play music—in math. He’s a crossword puzzle writer. There’s a reason crossword puzzles are popular: you can get lost in them without breaking any windows. The same thing is true for playing music.
I think drugs can fill the same needs as art — something to do that feels good in the doing of it, something to get lost in, something to escape the drudgery of everyday life — but without the nagging insecurities that artmaking can unfortunately provide like comparison and competition with others, the feeling that you’re not good or that you’ll never be good, wondering if this will every pay off (no one has ever wondered whether their drinking is going to be the lottery ticket that fixes their life).
When Jawbox broke up Barocas’ plan was to move to New York City, study film history and become a college professor. That last part doesn’t surprise me at all. Just like it doesn’t surprise me that he opened a stationery store and that he doesn’t dance. That combination of deep understanding, nerdy and addictive collecting, and a difficulty with letting loose describes almost every artist I know.
When you listen to Barocas speak you can tell that he’s thought a lot about the things he’s been through, what he’s done and why he’s done it and it makes for a fascinating interview. Listen here.
*Quote edited by me for clarity and flow
And if you want an interview that gets into the drums (and I mean, really gets into the drums) then check out this interview on Crash Bang Boom (which was recorded as Jawbox were relearning their songs for the reunion shows so it finds Barocas in a different headspace).